The Alternative Church and Chaos Theory

I am thinking that the church has functioned in an “ordered” paradigm for 1700yrs (since Constantine). In general, we don’t seem to be doing well as it relates to the population of the planet or growing in a way you might expect. If anything it seems that the traditional church model is becoming irrelevant and impotent in many ways (no offense intended). It seems that where the church has not had organization or “systems” because of legal issues or persecution it has grown at its fastest pace. My thinking is that the traditional church has become trapped and controlled by system and organizational dynamics regardless of the intentions of those involved. I propose an alternative approach…let’s let the church go and see what happens. Lets acknowledge, empower, encourage and facilitate the micro church in it’s multitudes of expression and allow them to become what their “tongue, tribe & nation” need them to be. Let’s facilitate the “chaos” of the power of God to express itself without the control that systems and organizations put on them.

The idea is that God and the power of the gospel is somewhat if not very chaotic by our standards. It has to do with the sovereignty and the omnipotence of God. What appears to be chaos to us is very manageable to God.

Our traditional church paradigms are very much a controlled system that we (humans) are comfortable with (hierarchical and lineal) but get in the way of and slow down the dynamics and the power of the gospel. The Alternative Church is an attempt to allow the power of the gospel to take a less “resistant” path (through independent micro churches) to the development of the Macro church.

By allowing the “church” to function without control in a sense we are putting our trust in God and the promises made by Jesus that He would send us the Holy Spirit as a guide, teacher and that He would intercede for us. The Alternative Church is an attempt to put the control of the church back in God’s “chaotic” and powerful hands (micro churches) and take away the controls imposed by human systems and organizations.

Chaos Theory:
A branch of science that deals with systems whose evolution depends very sensitively upon the initial conditions.

Chaotic systems are very sensitive to initial conditions; small changes in those conditions can lead to quite different outcomes.

What basic conditions are appropriate for becoming a micro church?
Doctrine?
Use of web based tool
Doing what a church does
What will training look like? How much can you influence a chaotic system?

Chaos theory and social constructs?

* How will the same conditions affect different social constructs (ethic groups, cultures, ages, sexes, subcultures, etc.)?

(references in prior post)

Bear with me a bit, because I have a couple of questions for you…

Giving to the poor is not mentioned as an evangelism tool at all that I can recall in the Bible… can you? It is seen as a good deed, it is seen as a way to support the church (body & organization), and it is seen as a way to give to God.

It’s a great idea, if it is giving over-and-above rather than instead-of the way God established in His Word. His ways are higher than our ways. To simply go about establishing our own ideas of what giving should be doesn’t acheive His Purposes His Way evidentally, or He would rescind the idea of giving to the church (organization) in the NT, which He doesn’t choose to do, but rather He emphasizes it.

I also think it (giving) is fun and exciting and helpful if we are also still following the way God planned it.

I like to give, it is just really personally rewarding, whether it is private or known, and whatever spiritual benefit there is to it is added to the joy of giving itself-that’s the way God is and sets things up it seems, doesn’t it?

However, if we are just attending MSU (Make Stuff Up), well, man’s ideas are no substitute for God’s.

Yes, he said you (people) are the church, but he also recognized the organization of the church and the giving of money to that church first. Not only in the OT but also in the new.

Interestingly, when speaking of giving money to the poor, Jesus said, “the poor you will have with you always” and he recommended that money be spent on his burial preparations rather than on the poor!

Anyway, my questions are these: one, I have read about people giving Rick Warren flack for his claim of reverse tithing while giving the money to organizations under his control. (bear in mind I tried to read his book and was bored with it, so I am not a Rick Warren junkie, I am trying to see if what he is doing is wrong in some way): What is the problem?

If he is not personally using the money but it is being spent on work for God and His People (whether through his organizations or not), then what is the problem? If it keeps money from having to be taxed (legally and morally, that is), then isn’t that a good thing? Why the issue? Whether his heart is right or full of pride is before God to judge, not us, so, my question is; is there something intrinsically wrong with what he is doing with his money or are people just bad-mouthing him?

My other issue is that i am wondering – is it possible, over time, to do the same sort of thing (obviously on a smaller scale), while still paying taxes and bills? How do people go about it?

What do you think?

I like your site!

Thanks for your input.

We’re not really talking about taking money “from” the church. We are the church. We’re talking about rearranging our priorities in giving.

We are not a storehouse. We’re not even a dispensation center. We are a people who are called to make the world a better place in the name of Jesus.

I think that two first steps would be to show concern for the poor and to invite those yet-to-believe to celebrate with us.

If we really want to be a new testament church body, it would be good to remember that they didn’t take their money from the church and have parties to celebrate God. Not that it would be wrong to have parties to celebrate God, I think that is a downright good idea.

They ‘continued daily in the temple, and they sold their possessions, having all things common’ – see Acts, particularly ch 2-5. They evidentally did not live together in a commune, because they also went from house to house, so it is apparent they sold whatever possessions which were not neccessary to the supporting of their household, in order to give to those in need.

They used what they had to supply the needs of others within the church. They were instructed to ‘do good to all, especially those who are of the household of faith’ – so it does not appear it was even used first and foremost to reach the lost but rather to help the church body of believers.

(Acts 2:44-47/Galatians 6:10/actually, many verses of the Bible support this- the giving of and to the Macedonians, the supporting of the widows and orphans in the church, the supporting of pastors and teachers who are workman worthy of their hire, etc)

Although Paul did not accept money himself, he did advise the church to pay its workers who laboured in the Word.

My quest is not to take money away from the church (Jesus, who commended the widow for giving to the church from her poverty, also said we ought to tithe – but not to leave out the greater issues of judgement, mercy, faith, and the love of God – Matthew 23:23/Luke 11:42 – KJV, anyway, & also in the Greek). Giving to the church is a joy and much is accomplished in God’s Kingdom through that.

My hope is to go above and beyond the tithe, which is given to the storehouse, beyond missions which are given to various organizations and missionaries, and to give freewill offerings to help the poor, to spread the gospel in various venues.

So how does one make the transition of giving all while making sure Uncle Sam gets his part (as Jesus also told us to do), and the daily cares of life are all still cared for (bills, kids college tuition, bills, kids college tuition, bills…lol)? Incrementally, I am supposing.

For me, it’s a challenge that we could all take up to some degree. I see the main issue as breaking out of the old thinking of what is secular and what is spiritual, and serving God with my whole life.

In the New Testament, there is not much distinction given in some ways between clergy and laity. We (the church) are all kings and priests in God’s Kingdom. We are all commissioned to go into all the world and preach the gospel and teach and make disciples. We are all responsible on a personal level for what we are doing with our finances to further God’s Kingdom.

That, after all, is the purpose of our finances:

“But thou shalt remember the LORD thy God: for it is he that giveth thee power to get wealth, that he may establish his covenant which he sware unto thy fathers, as it is this day.” (Deut. 8:18)

welcome to the mystic.

you write: “Who is stoping anyone from doing what you have suggested?”

no one. we are among those that encourage it.

but i don’t understand your point. how would giving generously to celebrate God’s Kingdom with the unreached and serving others with our resources harm the universal church?

Deanna, you gotta run that ad!
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