Comments on: Culture Code - Part 3

By: Alex

Alex — Thu, 25 Jan 2007 15:33:28 +0000

Rappaille means that at a yooung age Americans are emotionally imprinted with shopping = reconnecting.
Since there is nothing wrong with shopping in and of itself [unlike prostitution or drunkenness --not drinking --drunkenness], and we want to build on the healthiness of seeking to “reconnect with life”, we should ask how to exploit this American fact for the kingdom.

By: Andy

Andy — Thu, 25 Jan 2007 08:19:22 +0000

Alex - Thanks and I appreciate your concern, too. You pegged me on the Starbucks-rental thing.

One Question: Does Rapaille mean that Americans really reconnect with life through shopping or that they merely perceive it that way?

New Point: Is there an important, implicit point here that Americans don’t feel connected with life?

Observation: For a marketing guru all that’s important is perception. If Americans perceive that shopping reconnects them to life (and meets the felt need) then that’s all marketing gurus need to know (even church marketing gurus). But that leaves the larger question unanswered: How can Americans genuinely reconnect with life and stay connected with life?

By: James Petticrew

James Petticrew — Tue, 23 Jan 2007 11:00:31 +0000

Oh no shopping should conclude with dancing??? My marriage is doomed, I am even worse at dancing than I am at shopping! Its okay for you Alex with your Latin American rythmn and Brazilian wife, I am West of Scotland Scot (you probably had worked that out from the accent hadn’t you?) the only rythmn I heard growing up were the riveters guns in the ship yards. I am as likely to dance to the rythmn as sing in tune. Poor Ann, both her ears and her feet get assaulted.
Seriously, I do understand some of the concerns here, yes shopping can be about reconnection but how do we stop ourselves and our young people drawing self-worth from continuous consemerism? Shopping could end with a wonderful romantic evening with our spouse. (I am trying to convince myself of that) but I know for many shopping ends up with a credit card bill which shows the good feelings have had too high a cost. I understand the distinction you are making between shopping and buying but I fear on the weight of the billions of pounds spent on advertising in our culture it is a distinction that many find difficult if not impossible to maintain.

By: Alex

Alex — Mon, 22 Jan 2007 17:22:07 +0000

Ariah, if “shopping” –which is different than “buying” –means for Americans what Rapaille says it means, namely, Reconnecting With Life, than we should embrace shopping. Embracing shopping –that I sinfully resist by the way –is different than embracing “consumerism” or “buying”.

By the way, Andy, I’ll bet you and the others at Starbucks aren’t there shopping. You’re there “consuming,” “buying” or “renting” a seat at the cost of a latte so you can work there in good conscience. [At least, that is what I do anyway].

I think that what Rapaille would say, in contrast to your comment Andy, is that “buying” as you described it, is not what gives Americans a sense of life and power. He would say that “Shopping” and not “Buying” gives –at least women — a sense of life, a reconnecting with life, as he puts it.

By the way, I liked both (Ariah and Andy) your comments. One thing I would add Andy is a comment about mystery. You write:
“When I am not being defined by shopping and buying (or forming strategies or building kingdoms on the Internet), Iâ€™m slowly realizing that what God offers is better. â€œBetterâ€ in a profound sense. God offers a better quality of life than Iâ€™ve known so far except in moments. I find myself drawn toward a sense of adventure (the one that popped up in those moments). And then I ask, what if I gave myself to something greater than all this?”

Might not what God is offering be Himself? And might not this gift be attached to our real lives of shopping, buying, strategizing, and building kingdoms on the internet? Unlike you, I didn’t grow up in church so I don’t automatically bifurcate between a spiritual world and a material one. God is mysterious and he does make himself known in the profane. I know I was there. And you’re right, if we follow him, we enter an amazing adventure.

I’ve discovered that all humans regardless of their religion or lack of it, are fastened to their idols. I came to faith via a power encounter with the demonic. the demons and idols outside the church walls are big too. be careful out there. but do go there. christus victor.

By: Andy

Andy — Mon, 22 Jan 2007 12:00:45 +0000

I’m with Ariah on this. I think there are better ways to connect with life than shopping. If by “shopping” you just mean being out there with people, then maybe… Heck, that’s sort of what I do, only I call it, “Going to Starbucks” (which almost always means going to a place where shopping goes on).
But we Americans are raised in a consumer culture. I consume therefore I am (alive and connected). I feel that. My consumption, whether in the mall or (buying very large and expensive items) online both gives me a sense of life/power, and it also drives the machine.
When I am not being defined by shopping and buying (or forming strategies or building kingdoms on the Internet), I’m slowly realizing that what God offers is better. “Better” in a profound sense. God offers a better quality of life than I’ve known so far except in moments. I find myself drawn toward a sense of adventure (the one that popped up in those moments). And then I ask, what if I gave myself to something greater than all this?
I’m not talking about modifying my behavior (just to be clear), which I think is where religion goes with these things. Nor am I saying anyone, your wife included, should stop shopping. That’s how we end up “shoulding all over ourselves.” But I’m thinking that in our quest for cultural relevance, there’s a greater adventure than anything culture (including the religious appearance of it) understands. If so, it’s more relevant to speak of (and live out) mystery than to explain or justify following Jesus it in a way that sounds culturally practical or relevant. And we can give up the quest for cultural relevance and get on with better things.
Given I’m not trying to persuade Christians of anything these days, just trying to live among non-Christians and follow Jesus here, and by his grace I’ll be light and life. I sympathize with your burden to communicate to Christians. Leading Christians away from our own idols is much harder than leading non-Christians away from theirs. Again, and please believe me, that’s not a reference to your wife, yourself, or anyone in particular. It includes myself (I grew up in church) and all that still lies between myself and and this mystery of knowing Jesus and living in Christ.

By: Ariah Fine

Ariah Fine — Mon, 22 Jan 2007 06:25:42 +0000

Alex,
Whoa, I didn’t mean to jump into a stereotype of shopping being a man’s nemesis. If you had written about expensive football game tickets, plasma TVs or power tools being important to community I would have risen concern as well.

I completely understand your example of Jesus joyously participating with his loved ones in a way that shows love and care for the others interest. I’d still argue that shopping shouldn’t be something we embrace. Jesus loved tax collectors but he didn’t happily go and participate in tax collecting with them, nor did he participate in prostitution or drunkenness. Am I off-base?

By: Alex

Alex — Sun, 21 Jan 2007 23:42:44 +0000

Ariah,

On the one hand, I consider your comment to be a voice of reason. Thank you for standing up against man’s nemesis, shopping.

On the other hand, my wife reads my blog, so I’ll have to disagree with your zeal. I think Jesus would have gone shopping all day long with his wife and ended the day with a romantic dinner complete with wine and perhaps some slow dancing.

Yes, you’re right. The shopping experience I describe is a far cry from the type of community Christ calls us towards. When I go shopping I can barely drag my feet from exhaustion and feel like a pesky five year — are we done yet? Christ, on the other hand, would have laughedÂ a lot and hard while shopping.
He would have enjoyed a soft white ice cream with warm chocolate dripping on his chin. He would have winked playfully at children. He would perhaps even have had an opinion on women’s shoes. Undoubtedly, he would have languished at the thought of having to go home to check his email. Something I’m addicted to doing.

Oh, to be more like Christ and the community that walks with him. I’m afraid that I have a long, long way to go. Ask my wife.

By: Ariah Fine

Ariah Fine — Sun, 21 Jan 2007 23:10:06 +0000

Alex, I have to say your support of shopping as some sort of communal experience seems dangerous to me. It might be slightly more communal then living in our own private fortresses, but it’s a far cry from the type of community Christ calls us to live in scripture.

I’m sorry, but I think emphasizing shopping as a sort of spiritual experience is a stretch.

By: Andy

Andy — Fri, 19 Jan 2007 06:06:33 +0000

Hold that thought,
Make that, I consume therefore I am (God or like a god).
BTW, it wouldn’t be hard to modify the code at Voxtropolis so that comments appear with spaces between the lines (so users don’t have to write their own HTML to get a space). Most blogs have this feature these days, and you’re not one to be behind the times.

By: Andy

Andy — Fri, 19 Jan 2007 05:25:18 +0000

Shopping in Japan — defining/expressing who I am

BTW, there’s a shop here in Tokyo called: God

Also BTW, what company had the advertising campaign a few years ago with the triumphant music and the single phrase: I am (coke, pepsi??). At the time, I thought that it expressed something like: I shop, therefore I am God.