into the mystic

109 Responses to “WELCOME IMN 2006”

Comment by Alex

# February 9, 2006,

Brian, Thanks for joining us today for an IMN online conversation. You’ll get a chance to meet a lot of today’s participants in May during the 7-Day immersion.

Today’s conversation will conclude at 1.00PM (PST). aT around 12.59 or so, I’ll bring the conversation to a close. I’m sure others will come in later, read and comment. Also, this conversartion will continue to be available through the IMN archives on this blog.

Again, to Brian, thanks, and to everyone, enjoy.



Comment by Hermann du Plessis

# February 9, 2006,

Looking forward to read your conversation as I will be sound asleep here in Africa! I’ll read tommorow morning though. I love Brians Blog and look forward to reading the conversation.



Comment by Brandon Faris

# February 9, 2006,

I am excited….to experience this sharing of knowledge….Much love from the Nati (cincinnati)



Comment by Brian Russell

# February 9, 2006,

Greetings IMN cohort! It is a privilege to spend some time today in dialogue with one another.

Let me introduce myself briefly. My name is Brian Russell. I serve as an Associate Professor of Biblical Studies at Asbury Theological Seminary’s Orlando Campus. I am also a practitioner who teaches and preaches regularly in local churches. I am part of a team that is launching a new community of faith in the greater Orlando area. This is to say that I am not merely interested in theory for theory sake. I am passionate about intersecting biblical truth with the on the street reality. I am passionate about learning how to connect the Gospel of Jesus Christ with our world.

I am looking forward to our conversation.

Please introduce yourselves as you check in today. I will also have the opportunity of meeting many of your face to face in May in Los Angeles.



Comment by Brandon Faris

# February 9, 2006,

Brian,

Do you know Jim Woolums education guru at Campbellsville University and Asbury Alumni?



Comment by Sam.

# February 9, 2006,

Hi Brian, I’m looking forward to the conversation…thanks for taking the time.

And to everyone else, it’ll be good to hang out with you all once again for an hour. Rachel won’t be here this time I’m afraid, but she says hi and will have a read later.



Comment by Brian Russell

# February 9, 2006,

Our topic today is the development and implementation of a missional reading of the Bible. This is a conversation near and dear to my own thinking as I am writing a book with the working title “How to Read the Bible Missiologically.”

As you have time, I would invite you to check out my website Real Meal Ministries . I write regularly on mission and you will find much to supplement our conversations from today.

In particular the following essay will prove helpful (I hope) to our talk today and in our missional activities: Implementing a Missiological Reading in the Church.



Comment by Brian Russell

# February 9, 2006,

Let’s use a quote from Unstoppable Force to begin our conversation. Erwin McManus advocates a missiological reading of Scripture over against a mere theological reading. He writes:

A theological construct for interpretation finds success in the attainment of knowledge. The more you know, the more mature a Christian you are thought to be. And yet knowledge of the Bible does not guarantee application of the Bible. To know is not necessarily to do. When the construct applied to the Bible is missiological, you engage the Bible to discover the response required of your life. (p. 72)

McManus is definitely on to a strange phenomenon in our churches. We want to be entertained; we want to learn facts about the Bible; we want the preacher or teacher to feed us. But I wonder if we ever stop and ask ourselves, “What is it that the Bible wants to do to us?”

If mission is one of the principal reasons for the existence of the Church (the body of Christ), how can we read the Bible in such a way as to convert both our fellow Christ-followers to God’s mission in the world and invite non-believers to join this mission as well?



Comment by Octavio Martinez

# February 9, 2006,

good afternoon everyone.

alex, good to see you back.
brian, i’ve been looking forward to this!
brandon, hello again. good to see you.
sam, hey man, i’m using your skin on vox.



Comment by Brian Russell

# February 9, 2006,

Greetings Brandon, Sam, and Octavio.

Brandon, I think that I have heard Jim’s name but I don’t think that I’ve met him. Campbellsville is in Kentucky (right?) — I work primarily in Orlando, Florida.



Comment by Brian Russell

# February 9, 2006,

Also, let me remind everyone to hit the REFRESH button on your web browser in order to read new comments.



Comment by Brandon Faris

# February 9, 2006,

Yeah…he said he hasn’t crossed path’s with you yet…but read up on you in the Asbury newsletter….

I think on your first comment, we read the bible as a guidebook instead of a textbook. We have to read/teach like Jesus in that we read a little, then we “do” a little, then reflect on how the doing lines up with the reading….this is how I mentor…sorry if that was rhetorical.



Comment by Sam.

# February 9, 2006,

I think very often we read and interpret the Bible in very static ways when in reality it is a book of movement. God moving in and through people to further His purposes on the earth. It is very easy to pull out theological principles and miss the bigger picture of movement that is being portrayed. I think that is why we need to recapture the Bible as being a story and a story that is still ongoing today and that we can become part of. I liked the subtitle to John Eldredge’s book ‘Epic’ which was ‘The story God is telling and the role that is yours to play’.



Comment by Octavio Martinez

# February 9, 2006,

brian,

first, teach the holy book in a missiological context. train folks to see the stories of scripture as encounters with god versus a set facts to me memorized.

second, do what you teach. if you want folks to invite people, share their faith, spend time with those who do not share our views, you got to do it first. i think it’s impossible (and harmful) to teach without doing.



Comment by Brandon Faris

# February 9, 2006,

But, what about the danger of it becoming void of the meaning…and now we are just doing, because its part of our process…..checklist.



Comment by Sam.

# February 9, 2006,

I think the very fact that we can think of teaching in ways that are separated from doing emphasises how much we could misinterpret Jesus’ ministry as a Teacher.



Comment by Octavio Martinez

# February 9, 2006,

brandon,

you make a valid point.
i think there’s a way to avoid this danger, but brian, what say you?



Comment by Brian Russell

# February 9, 2006,

I think that it is crucial to see the relationship between reading Scripture and missional activity in a circle. They exist together. Too often these activities have been undertaken in isolation. Reading/Interpreting Scripture informs our missional work, but our missional work will continually drive us back to the text with new questions and a desire to be recharged and renewed.



Comment by Eriq Devine

# February 9, 2006,

Hey Brian, this is eriq in Silver City, NM. I’m glad to be here. I believe that we need to get rid of the seperation between clergy & laiety. People need to be empowered and given confidence that God wants to use them specifically and intentially wherever they are.



Comment by dean Sharp

# February 9, 2006,

hi everyone.



Comment by Brian Russell

# February 9, 2006,

I think that Octavio is right on target on the necessity of leaders actually leading in missional activity. I think that in our generation we need to recapture the image of pastor/leader as “missionary preacher/teacher” instead of older images of pastor as CEO or as resident theologian.



Comment by Brandon Faris

# February 9, 2006,

Brian,

The centrifuge circle thing I think has caused us to become selfserving….? My local baptist church is a VORTEX of programs that serve us….and this seems to be the case for many churches.



Comment by Brian Russell

# February 9, 2006,

Hi Eriq and Dean,
Welcome aboard!



Comment by Brandon Faris

# February 9, 2006,

instead of a circle….what if we view the process as BREATHING…..in with text out with mission. this way we can’t recycle what comes out…its not useful to us anymore….make sense?



Comment by Brian Russell

# February 9, 2006,

Brandon has touched a key point of practical import. How do we move past the Church as service center (meaning essentially service of the needs of the congregation) instead of mobilizing center for mission to the world? I link the image of a centrifuge — it is a scary one.

How can we shape the way that we do “Christian education” so that it becomes transformative instead of merely informative?

Perhaps, we should limit the number of times that people are allowed to enter the church’s facility in a given week 8^) ?



Comment by Sam.

# February 9, 2006,

I think in the life of Jesus you see Him go through various stages in His teaching:

1] I do; you watch
2] We do together
3] You do; I watch
4] You go and train up others

It is very much an apprentice, missional approach.



Comment by Octavio Martinez

# February 9, 2006,

brandon,

great metaphor!
breathe in the spirit, breathe out service.
balanced approach.



Comment by Brandon Faris

# February 9, 2006,

I like that sam…!



Comment by Sam.

# February 9, 2006,

My dad’s cousin is an Anglican vicar and I was chatting with him my cousins wedding recently and we got to talking about an MBA he’s been doing. Basically, on that course he was asked who his customers were. This presented a dilema. Was it the members of the church or was the people in the community around the church. As he weighed this up, he felt that the community are the customers. He was then asked, what does that make your members then? And he said “staff, I guess”. I think this is the direction churches need to be going in; members seeing themselves as staff there TO serve rather than TO BE served.



Comment by Octavio Martinez

# February 9, 2006,

sam,
good observation/summary.

brian,
i have resisted multiple mid-week bible studies to minimize visits to church (the building) and instead encourage the Church (followers) to visit their communities.



Comment by Brandon Faris

# February 9, 2006,

Sam….I like that…but how does that happen in a consumer world where we just want to get FAT!



Comment by Octavio Martinez

# February 9, 2006,

brandon,

…it happens the same way to avoid being fat in any sphere…movement.



Comment by Sam.

# February 9, 2006,

Octavio, I’m definitely with you on minimising church meetings and having a church that is “out there” as opposed to always “in here”. It’s a challenge though as there are lots of Christians who just love meetings excessively so!



Comment by Jon Olson (aka Levi)

# February 9, 2006,

Hello everyone, Jon Olson here sorry I am a little late.



Comment by Brian Russell

# February 9, 2006,

Sam’s story is critical.

1)How do we change our teaching and preaching of Scripture in order to create an ethos of service rather than an ethos of consumption?

2) Think about our own practices of preaching. What sort of ethos does our current practice create?



Comment by dean Sharp

# February 9, 2006,

Brian,
Would you give us an example of a missiological v. static theological interpretive at work?



Comment by Sam.

# February 9, 2006,

Brandon, I don’t think it’s easy, but I think the challenge as leaders is to not give people what they want, but what they truly need. We need to have the strength of character to stick to what we believe is right, even if we lose some people to churches who may be prepared to pamper them.



Comment by Brian Russell

# February 9, 2006,

Welcome Jon.

Are all of you guys leading communities of faith?



Comment by Octavio Martinez

# February 9, 2006,

brian,

i am.
still thinking about your earlier question.



Comment by Chris Bell

# February 9, 2006,

Well if it a 30 minute sermon monologue then the ethos you are creating is a consumer ethos.

by the way Chris from Miami



Comment by Brandon Faris

# February 9, 2006,

I see this happening in the form of social sabotage in love.

“Christianity is the story of how the rightful King has landed you might say in disguise, and is calling us to take part in His great compaingn of sabotage.” C.S. Lewis

We have to move the church like Octavio away from the “church building” and slowing take over community locations as extensions of the church.



Comment by dean Sharp

# February 9, 2006,

I am fattening lambs for slaughter at The Spring in Thousand Oaks, CA.



Comment by Jon Olson (aka Levi)

# February 9, 2006,

My understanding about scripture reading is that we seek to gain knowledge about God rather than experience God through scripture. The historical/critical method helped to further this idea that scripture can be unlocked with the right knowledge (I am not saying some of the h/c stuff isn’t helpful).
I don’t think it so much where we meet or how meet, the question is are we encountering the living God through scripture and are we being transformed through that experience.
My supposition is that a person who encounters God in Christ can’t help but share that love. I think that is what we see throughout scripture–people encountering God, being transformed, obeying God and sharing His love with others.



Comment by Chris Bell

# February 9, 2006,

I am leading a new community of faith.



Comment by Sam.

# February 9, 2006,

Mosaic Sheffield will be launching in April, Brian! I’ve been the assistant pastor or a black majority Pentecostal church and me and my wife Rachel sensed God calling us to start Mosiac around August last year.



Comment by Sam.

# February 9, 2006,

Most preaching I see (and have done) has been largely informational. Not nearly enough is transformational and not nearly enough is focussed on equipping. When I think of the role of the five-fold ministry it is about leaders equipping all members to serve. I want to very much shift my teaching into line with this.



Comment by Jon Olson (aka Levi)

# February 9, 2006,

I am in transition from a solo position as a pastor of Lutheran church in Southern Oregon to an associate pastor of a congregation in Auburn, Washington.



Comment by Steve Byrum

# February 9, 2006,

Hi, everyone.



Comment by Brandon Faris

# February 9, 2006,

Levi….is it scripture that transforms us or the power of the Holy Spirit? Scripture has also been used to do horrible things…when not interpreted correctly.



Comment by Eriq Devine

# February 9, 2006,

I am planting in New Mexico. I love preaching, but so did Herod. I like to look at the sword comming out of Jesus mouth in Rev. As the preaching of the Gospel advancing the Kingdom of God. But maybe all our sermons do not need to be preached from a stage or a pulpit. Like was mentioned by Sam earlier there is movement in the scriptures. Jesus was always on the move.



Comment by Brandon Faris

# February 9, 2006,

Alex,

you’re quiet…what are your thoughts…



Comment by Brian Russell

# February 9, 2006,

In response to Dean’s question, here is a very brief example:

Take the command from Exodus 20 “Remember the Sabbath day by keeping it holy.” A static theological reading would focus on the community of faith itself — perhaps lamenting on the demise of Sunday blue laws or stressing the need for every Christian to take a “personal sabbath” or articulating activities that are OK to do on Sunday.

Such questions have some validity as research into the history of interpretation would attest, but this sort of interpretive work does not go far enough. A missiological reading (which by the way is not a foreign intrusion onto the text) always is interested in how a given passage fits into the Big Picture of the Bible.

In this case, Sabbath is related to Creation. This means that God has made sabbath part of the creative fabric of the universe. Sabbath is also a community activity — there is no such thing as a “personal sabbath.” This should push us in the church to ask “How can we as a community of faith embody the command to desist from labor in order to serve as a witness to the sort of people that God intends for us to be”? Think about the witness that the church could become in our crazy 24/7 driven world.

I could say more but I hope that this gives you a little idea of what I am getting at. In other words, we should ask “How does this text fit into the overarching story of God’s mission? What sort of ethos does such a text assume for the people of God? What sort of invitation is implicit for those outside of Jesus Christ?”



Comment by Alex

# February 9, 2006,

brandon, I was thinking about a church that complained that they couldn’t do evangelism because they were so busy with church stuff. so i called their bluff….



Comment by Sam.

# February 9, 2006,

Eric, you’re right about not all of our sermons needing to be preached from a stage. Some of the greatest fruit I’ve seen from my teaching has been round dinner tables, sitting in lounges, and when out and about in the real world.



Comment by Jon Olson (aka Levi)

# February 9, 2006,

Brandon, good comment–I think you know the answer in your question. It is the Spirit. There is a way to go the scriptures with pride, arrogance and an agenda. The text can become then a proof text.
The other way is to come to the text in humility and submission.



Comment by Octavio Martinez

# February 9, 2006,

alex,

….and?



Comment by Alex

# February 9, 2006,

i worked with them to eliminate the church stuff, the activities, prayer meetings, etc, so they could have time to interact with those outside. the result…nothing.

they just filled up the time spent in church with time doing chores. finally time to clean the garage or work on the yard.



Comment by Brian Russell

# February 9, 2006,

Hi Steve and Chris!



Comment by Steve Byrum

# February 9, 2006,

alex, evangelism should be like breathing. Christ should emote from our very being.



Comment by Sam.

# February 9, 2006,

I was a part of St Thomas’ Church in Sheffield for several years when I was at uni and they placed a lot of emphasis on work/rest balance linked with creation/sabbath etc. And for them, that meant that July and August was like a time of community sabbath where everything would slow down, the focus would be on drawing near to God, etc. I liked it.



Comment by Steve Byrum

# February 9, 2006,

it seems so easy for us as human beings to compartmentalize life. church, culturally in U S is for sundays. acts 2 says it occured everyday.



Comment by Brandon Faris

# February 9, 2006,

On reading the bible missiologically (I can’t spell) Are we even equipped with our limited understandings of Old Testiment context and Language to do this complete justice. I mean I think we have some great tools, but unless you live in the context and speak greek or hebrew….aren’t we always looking at somewhat of a shadow….? I’ve heard so many different teachings on similar topics that it almost sounds like its coming from different sources…..anyone else ever get this sense?



Comment by Steve Byrum

# February 9, 2006,

abraham was on a journey. each and every day God revealed himself and deepened the relationship. abraham didn’t appear to study the concept of God, but rather got to know him. why would he be willing to sacrifice his son isaac for an idea?



Comment by Jon Olson (aka Levi)

# February 9, 2006,

Another thought is to ask the question what is God up to in the world and how is God calling us (the community and individuals) to be a part of His work in the world.



Comment by dean Sharp

# February 9, 2006,

so then, a missiological approach to ex20 must include the question of how we can help usher humanity back into that creation sabbath?



Comment by Brian Russell

# February 9, 2006,

The key ultimately is to help our people to see themselves as part of the grand narrative of Scripture. Let me remind us of two interconnected texts:

In Exodus 19:4-6, Israel receives an invitation to covenant with the God of the Exodus. In exchange for faithful obedience, God offers status: treasured possession and a twin vocation: kingdom of priests and a holy nation.

In other words, the full salvation of Israel implied that Israel was to serve as a servant nation for the world as God’s chosen people. Israel was to be a nation of priests, i.e., intermediaries who link the world to God — this is mission. Israel was to be a community (kingdom and nation). Israel was to reflect God’s character to the world (this is the essence of holiness).

This remains the vocation of God’s people today. Peter made this clear in 1 Peter 2:9 “You are a chosen people, a royal priesthood, a holy nation, God’s own people in order that you may proclaim the mighty acts of him who called you out of darkness into his marvellous light.”



Comment by Brandon Faris

# February 9, 2006,

experiencing God thing…



Comment by Brian Russell

# February 9, 2006,

Brandon,
I think that your question is crucial, but I am not sure that I am following you. Can you rephrase it?



Comment by Eriq Devine

# February 9, 2006,

Jon I liked what you said:
“My supposition is that a person who encounters God in Christ can’t help but share that love. I think that is what we see throughout scripture–people encountering God, being transformed, obeying God and sharing His love with others”

But why do you think there are so many Jonah’s in the church?They people who don’t want to go out and would much rather just condem.



Comment by Derek Webster

# February 9, 2006,

Brian,
I resonate with the idea of a common narrative. In that context, we don’t reinterpret Scripture to fit a missional agenda. Rather, we become a part of the missional movement of God.



Comment by Octavio Martinez

# February 9, 2006,

brian,

excellent summary.



Comment by Brian Russell

# February 9, 2006,

Dean and Levi,
I think that you are both correct. I think that this also implicitly involves moving from trying to meet merely the “felt needs” of people to offering an invitation to a relationship with the only god who can truly fill our deepest longings as human beings. We need to read the text with an eye to its deepest meanings.



Comment by Brandon Faris

# February 9, 2006,

If we rely on knowledge, can we fully be confident in our endevours, because our understanding is second hand? Therefore we have to trust that the Spirit is doing something with us, otherwise we should all be learning fluent greek and hebrew to pass on the REAL truth of the gospel…? any better.



Comment by Derek Webster

# February 9, 2006,

Deepest meanings are still held together by exegesis, though, and not by reading into Scripture what we want to see. Reading carefully is not reinterpretation - which seems to be the trap that led us to a church that segments evangelism or even missions as one part of the church, rather than the ethos that drives it.



Comment by Brian Russell

# February 9, 2006,

Yes, Derek. Instead of looking to Scripture for prooftexts of why we should be on mission, we should see the Bible as existing because of God’s mission in the world . In other words, as missiologist Chris Wright says, “Instead of talking about a biblical basis for mission we should be talking about the missional basis of the Bible.” This is a paraphrase of Wright but it is accurate.

I think that this is dead on. A missional reading is not merely an add on application to our sermon or an ideological grid through which we justify our own missional practices rather it is a reading the emerges out of a close study of the text itself.



Comment by Derek Webster

# February 9, 2006,

I wonder if we focus too much on either knowledge or on experience. It seems the basic interpretation comes down to obedience - ie. read the example, command, or narrative and to join it.



Comment by Steve Byrum

# February 9, 2006,

this past weekend many of us experienced the intimacy that some have with the pittsburg steelers. from their dedication and worship, i heard more about the steelers, their past, present and future than i ever imagined.
if we could convey that out of intimacy with christ, He will be made know - that would be cool.



Comment by Jon Olson (aka Levi)

# February 9, 2006,

I can only speak my experience in the Lutheran tradition–I observe that people do religion rather than discipleship. Therefore they have limited experiencial knowledge of God and are insecure with themselves and their faith. Therefore they function like practical atheists or try to make themselves feel better by putting down others. Kind of like “mean girls” but in religion.
On the other hand scripture shoud transform us through the renewing of our minds so that we might learn to love God, obey Him and love our neighbor and serve them.



Comment by Sam.

# February 9, 2006,

I like that quote/paraphase, Brian. Really good.

Have you or anyone read NT (Tom) Wright’s article on Scripture and the authority of God? It link in some of these thoughts, if I remember correctly.



Comment by Derek Webster

# February 9, 2006,

I do have a question from a comment earlier on the idea of a 30 minute conversation rather than a 30 minute monologue. Even monologues can draw us in - Peter’s seemed to do just fine in Acts. More than that, listening to someone complete their framework of thought or presentation in the form of a message helps the listener not to jump into a conversation for which they are ill-informed. I view the message (monologue or otherwise) as a contextual invitation to connect with someone afterwards. What do you think?



Comment by Steve Byrum

# February 9, 2006,

i am teaching a special topics in evangelism right now and some people’s heads are spinning around. they want to learn a method, a plan. can we be in danger of compartmentalizing God into a 7 minute presentation?



Comment by Eriq Devine

# February 9, 2006,

I was traveling this past weekend and did not watch the SuperBowl. But I saw Steeler stuff everywhere I went. Great anaology Steve.



Comment by Brandon Faris

# February 9, 2006,

Steve, intimacy with the STEELERS says “DRINK BEER AND HIGH FIVE!” Intamacy with Christ says “DIE.” I don’t think it is that easy….



Comment by Brian Russell

# February 9, 2006,

Brandon,
I don’t see serious study and the inspiration of the Spirit in tension. Greek and Hebrew are always helpful tools to possess. I don’t think that serious exegetical work done in a context of prayer in the service of God’s mission will ever become optional. In fact, in the West, I think that we need to up the ante. I am now encountering regularly Muslims for example who want to talk about the Bible. They know many of the stories but they have their own “take” on them via the interpretation of the Bible found in the Koran. In my view, this calls for even greater study on our part. We need to flat out know the story precisely in the service of the mission of God.



Comment by dean Sharp

# February 9, 2006,

wow, time flies. great being with everyone but i need to go have lunch with my business partner/wife/mistress, christina. i’ll be back to see everbody’s last comments later.

Thanks so much Brian, and Alex.

Cheers.



Comment by Chris Bell

# February 9, 2006,

I think that is good Derek. However, I also think that many sermons today do not have that as thier aim.



Comment by Derek Webster

# February 9, 2006,

A thought on the Steelers: I wonder if we aren’t being too hard on the church in this context. Many people do convey their passion for Jesus, but don’t have the backing of network TV (and would we really watch it if it was broadcast?), salaries, and a SuperBowl. I understand your point on communication and passion, but wonder if Christianity is more like guerilla marketing rather than major event.



Comment by Steve Byrum

# February 9, 2006,

this was fantastic. fast and furious - like life.
thanks so much Brian and Alex for arranging this.
peace,
steve



Comment by Brandon Faris

# February 9, 2006,

Yes…Derek…graffiti for Jesus….



Comment by Brian Russell

# February 9, 2006,

I know that our time is running short. I will linger a bit longer. I will be with all of you on the weekend before Origins to talk more about this. I want our brief time together in May to be as helpful as possible.

What are some of your burning questions?
What would you find the most helpful?

You can also send me an enote at brian@realmealministries.org



Comment by Alex

# February 9, 2006,

I believe it all comes down to foundations laid long before any of us where born. We all have GONE to church, every GOES to church. I don’t believe there is a church that goes to the people (traditionally speaking). Therefore we don’t have a foundation of get action from the scriptures but rather having the scripture speak to US. I guess Erwin put it best in BW. We have a culture of come and listen (my paraphrase). Why would we be reading the Bible any differently?



Comment by Octavio Martinez

# February 9, 2006,

alex & brian,

this has been great.
thank so much.
i’m going to print the commentsa and read them again.



Comment by Alex Comesanas

# February 9, 2006,

I should have written my last name. On the previous Alex post (I am Alex Comesanas, not Mcmanus)



Comment by Alex

# February 9, 2006,

hey guys, time’s up. Thanks for participating in an IMN online conversation. Excellent stuff.

Brian, thanks again. Looking forward to hearing more in May in LA.



Comment by Derek Webster

# February 9, 2006,

Brian,
I agree - but not quite on the Greek and Hebrew aspect (especially because I have them as exegetical tools). The difficulty with requiring or even encouraging such tools, even to up the ante, is to expect others to possess those tools in order to correctly interpret Scripture. In Europe this has led to people actually giving up on Scripture altogether because they are theologically trained. I’ve heard this first-hand. If Scripture was written for a shepherd and/or 13 year old boy to follow, then what are the best criteria for a missiological exegesis?



Comment by Sam.

# February 9, 2006,

Thanks for your time, Brian. It’s been helpful and thought-provoking.



Comment by Brian Russell

# February 9, 2006,

Chris and Derek,
The nature of preaching is a topic worthy of its own thread. I think that it is important simply for us to find our own style and to be persons of character. As long as the biblical talk/sermon/dialogue is rooted in a close reading of the passage and helps its hearers to find their place in the biblical narrative, God can use it to convert the Church and World to His mission.



Comment by Alex

# February 9, 2006,

Stay tuned for details about our next IMN online chat. Alex [McManus] out.



Comment by Derek Webster

# February 9, 2006,

Thanks Brian & Alex.

This was fun once I got the hang of which threads to follow and how often to hit the refresh button:). Some really good thoughts here. Thanks for taking the time.



Comment by Brian Russell

# February 9, 2006,

Thank you to everyone for an engaging conversation.

Thank you to Alex McManus for the kind invitation.

May God continue to lead and guide us into His Mission.



Comment by Brandon Faris

# February 9, 2006,

Its been sweet…I can’t wait to have some face-time in L.A. Thanks everyone….

P.S. Octavio…..I’m stepping out. I’ve got One church committed to supporting my endevour and God has clarified that He wants me to start a MOVEMENT (Downtown Cincinnati) Urban. God is putting people in front of me every step of the way. Yesterday I had a waiter at “Fuddruckers” african american guy (huge, not alot of diversity in cincinnati, divided) overhear our conversation on the Movement of Love towards downtown cincy, He doesn’t even know Jesus, but He wants to meet with me……unbelievable….



Comment by Jon Olson (aka Levi)

# February 9, 2006,

Brian,
Thanks for the comment about scripture being evidence of God’s mission in the world.
Alex, I think listening is good if obedience follows. I think many people don’t obey–reminds me of Erwins message a few weeks ago about Elijah.



Comment by Derek Webster

# February 9, 2006,

quick correction: in an earlier post I wrote: theologically trained. I meant - NOT theologically trained. That sentence should make a little more sense now.



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# February 9, 2006,

[…] If you would like to check out the conversation, the entire exchange can be found on Alex’s site. […]



Comment by Chris Bell

# February 9, 2006,

We are definately off topic, but one last off topic comment. While I do think we need to find our own style of preaching/teaching. We do need to ask the question concerning the medium we use to convey the message. I am not arguing for one medium over the other, but that we examine how our style effects the message, if it even does.



Comment by Brian Russell

# February 9, 2006,

Chris,
I think that you are correct. We need to reflect critically on all of our practices (personal and corporate) to make certain that they truly serve God’s desires and ends.



Comment by Chris Bell

# February 9, 2006,

Brian thanks for leading the conversation - even if some of us went off topic (sorry - not intentional). I will be reading your posts on realmealministries.org



Comment by Brian Russell

# February 9, 2006,

Derek,
I am by no means advocating the universal necessity of knowing the biblical languages. I agree with your assessment. The danger for interpretation to reside only in the hands of experts (ecclesial or modern researchers) is clear from history and is the epitomy of human hubris.

I do think though that we can help to train followers of Jesus to read Scripture wisely for themselves.



Comment by Viktoria menem

# October 12, 2006,

thanks Brandon i would like to know more where are you located i belong to dubble aa and i have a contact with my superior power but i think i need more i would apricate it if you can e/mail me thanks
viky